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PhotoLine 19 released.

25 May 2015 13:08 #10791 by Banj
PhotoLine 19 released. was created by Banj
I don't know much about the application myself, but I have frequently seen people raving about it like it's the second coming. It's basically a cheap alternative to Photoshop with some additional bells and whistles that PS doesn't have. A new version has just been released:

www.pl32.com/index.php

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25 May 2015 14:33 #10792 by kazky
Replied by kazky on topic PhotoLine 19 released.
Hmm that looks interesting, I just bought the software Joe mentioned so I'll probably play with that before I buy this one.

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25 May 2015 18:22 #10795 by edtuckerartist
Looks like Gimp and I've never been much of a fan of that.

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28 May 2015 22:00 #10846 by Herbert123
Replied by Herbert123 on topic PhotoLine 19 released.

Looks like Gimp and I've never been much of a fan of that.


Couldn't be further from the truth. The workflow is completely different: Photoline offers a full 16/32bpc workflow which is mostly non-destructive. And you can even import 32bpc multi-layered EXR files. In terms of image processing and compositing only Photoshop can compete. File resolution and number of layers is pretty much only limited by your RAM - if you want a 5 million pixel wide file it will support that (Photoshop's limit is 300.000)

The game-changing feature is the layer system, though: any layer in the layer stack can be ANY colour space and/or bit depth. Thus, you can combine a Lab mode 32bpc layer with rgb layers of various bit depths, and import a CMYK image in the same layer stack without the need for an "image mode" switch. The background layer decides to what the final image will be calculated to.
Which means that all those layers retain their original information, and a simple background layer mode change allows you to generate output for different purposes.

And have you heard of any other layer based image editor that allows you to set the layer opacity from -200 up to +200 percent? I laughed out loud the first time I saw that is possible in PL - such a time saver.

Layer masks behave like regular layers, and can be combined into groups, referenced (virtual layers) for recycling, and even adjustment layers can be applied to layer masks. And vector layers are "true" vectors in Photoline - which can also be freely combined with bitmap layers to generate masks.

Anyway, in short: it is a great compositing and image processing tool that compares very well to Photoshop (sans 3d and video), and in some areas surpasses it. And in some Photoshop is better. As always, no tool is perfect.

The painting tools are okay, but not great, though. Compositing and image processing are its strengths - I use Photoline in combination with Krita, and do my painting in Krita. Photoline has a round-trip app link which allows for sending a specific layer or an entire file to any other pixel aware application for further editing, and when the changes are saved, PL automatically updates the layer or file in question. For vector layers this also works with InkScape, for example. (As a matter of fact, I use Gimp as a sort of "plugin" for Photoline in the same manner to have access to certain Gimp specific filters I use sometimes.)

Krita and Photoline complement each-other almost perfectly - very comparable to the Photoshop/Painter combo (which I used before) - with the difference that the app link often makes it a more seamless editing experience.

I switched from Photoshop to Photoline about two and a half years ago, after having worked with Photoshop since version 3.5! Photoline has really surprised me in many respects. And it is inexpensive and can even be taken with you on a usb key (both the mac and win version). The latest version adds workflow improvements across the board. Just the new dehaze filter alone makes it worth it.

Btw, the colourful icons can be switched to grey ones, and the GUI supports a dark one as well (in seamless steps!).

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28 May 2015 22:58 - 28 May 2015 23:02 #10847 by kazky
Replied by kazky on topic PhotoLine 19 released.
Very informative Herbert, and welcome to the forum, you don't work for Photoline do you?

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28 May 2015 23:04 #10848 by kazky
Replied by kazky on topic PhotoLine 19 released.
I don't know what's going on but the forum edits my post to a single sentence! Anyway, that was a joke, and I wonder if you can elaborate on your comment that the painting tools aren't brilliant please?

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29 May 2015 04:56 - 29 May 2015 05:33 #10850 by Herbert123
Replied by Herbert123 on topic PhotoLine 19 released.

Very informative Herbert, and welcome to the forum, you don't work for Photoline do you?

Of course I do ;)

No, I am just a bit of a Photoline zealot since I switched - though I (hopefully) keep a realistic perspective on things. About half a year before Adobe became a digital serfdom only culture, I decided I wanted to try other image editors and painting applications, since I saw the signs on the wall. It was troublesome, because most image editors can hardly deal with 16bpc, let alone 32bpc.

During my research and discovery phase I just happened to land on the Photoline website by sheer accident, and I almost left immediately - the site looks horrendously amateurish. At first glance you would not have know that their software is an image editor (the new site went online this week - still not great, but acceptable now).

It was then that my eyes fell on "16/32bit", and I reluctantly gave it a shot, preparing for the expected disappointment. The download was tiny compared to a behemoth such as Photoshop, so I did not have high expectations at all. And I was pleasantly surprised - I mean, there were many rough edges, but the potential was there, and certain aspects of the workflow actually already were an improvement over some of Photoshop's quirks.

Anyway, these last two and a half years I asked the devs to implement certain workflow changes, improvements, and new tools, and amazingly enough most of those were taken seriously, and implemented!! That was certainly a change from Adobe's lackluster customer support, indeed. For example, I asked them if it was possible to support multi-layered EXR files - and a month later the first beta version with EXR support was ready. Middle mouse button pan view option? A week later implemented. Just a week ago I was working on a mural print (10 by 2meters), and I could not zoom out sufficiently for the design to be visible fully on my screen (max 2% zoomout). The NEXT day, after I suggested a 1% or less zoom out factor, with the final release candidate for v19 they had that fixed. And many more suggestions of mine, and other users, were implemented.

I started out with v17, and in just two versions so many workflow enhancements have been built into the app, that I have been able to completely bin Photoshop CS6 - I merely start up Photoshop for the odd troublesome psd conversion here and there.

As always, there are good and weaker points to each application. On overall, I work faster in Photoline now, than I ever did in Photoshop. Although some may disagree on that with me. I do miss one or two things I was accustomed to in Photoshop - but nothing that cannot be solved with a plugin (for example, I use Topaz ReMask for more complex hair masks, and such (yes, Photoline loads generic Photoshop plugins)).

To close, I love ImagineFX magazine (looking at a couple of issues in my bookcase as I write this), and love SciFi/Fantasy artwork, and also dabble a bit myself. So I stumbled on this forum by accident (never was aware of the fact ImagineFX had a forum, for some reason), so I am going to lurk a bit, and see if I can find the time to work on some ideas of my own.

Sorry for the long post.

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29 May 2015 05:30 - 29 May 2015 05:59 #10851 by Herbert123
Replied by Herbert123 on topic PhotoLine 19 released.

I don't know what's going on but the forum edits my post to a single sentence! Anyway, that was a joke, and I wonder if you can elaborate on your comment that the painting tools aren't brilliant please?


The painting tools in v19 have seen some important improvements. For example, the blend mode can now be set - something so fundamental, and it was not available before this latest release. That does make it more viable for painting now. It also loads up Photoshop brushes, although the painting capability is comparable to Photoshop before the overhauled paint engine - which means it is not bad, but not great either.

Brush options include scattering, jitter controls, precise curve control for the brush shape/smoothness. Photoshop brushes can be loaded up. Interestingly enough, not only basic colour can be chosen to paint with, but also any gradient, texture, or pattern. Photoline has a built-in procedural texture generator, and those textures can also be used to paint with.

Another useful option are the channel buttons: you can paint in any channel of your choice. Even HSV, Lab, or in the transparency channel. This last bit can be quite useful, since the eraser tool does not actually erase the layer contents: it is a non-destructive action, and areas that were erased can be displayed again by painting in the transparency channel only. Sounds weird, but is actually quite useful - for example, the transparency in a PNG file can be removed, and the hidden information displayed, if any (there often is).

One thing I and other users requested was a smooth stroke option - comparable to Krita's and Gimp's smooth stroke. The reason for this was that I noticed that when I drew a thin line on a zoomed out canvas in either Photoshop or Photoline, the line would be very jaggy and curves would be flattened - quite unusable, actually. The devs implemented the smooth option, which works very well. It is not on par with the options in either Krita or ClipStudio (Manga Studio), but still extremely helpful, and the quality of thin strokes is very good now. Much better than Photoshop, unless Lazy Nezumi Pro happens to be installed.

The clone stamp tool in Photoline ("Copy Brush A") is also very good in this new version. Photoline's layer concept of the active layer and selected layers is helpful, and it remembers which layer you clicked as a source.

A "filter brush" is also available. With that certain filter effects (gaussian blur, sharpen, soften, and eleven others) can be painted in your work.

Of note is the stamp tool. This can behave as a coloured brush tool - comparable to Deluxe Paint's brushes (if you remember the Amiga ;-), and it allows for full coloured brushes to be used while painting. Even Photoline files can be used as a coloured brush, and the layer ordering allows for "animated" effects while painting. The settings are separate from the normal brush settings, unfortunately - the usability could be improved a lot.
Still, it is kinda cool to be able to load up a fully layered file which you have worked on previously, and start spraying it all over the canvas :woohoo:

Anyway, it does not even come close to Krita in terms of painting tools, and neither does Krita even compare to the compositing tools in Photoline, which is why they make such a great combo.

To learn more about the painting tools in Photoline, try them out!

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29 May 2015 09:23 #10854 by Banj
Replied by Banj on topic PhotoLine 19 released.
Thanks for the info Herbert, I sort of know you from The Foundry forums (maybe that should be the The Foundry forums? :hmm:). You are one of the ravers I mentioned in my post :P

You joined at about the right time as we are about to have a major overhaul of the site sometime in the next few weeks.

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29 May 2015 10:10 #10855 by kazky
Replied by kazky on topic PhotoLine 19 released.
Ok that was brilliant information thank you, glad you found us & I think i'll try it out now :)

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